Shutdown after R-andro

Feb 9, 2020
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#21
Not trying to make light of this or be an ass, but you’ve crashed your estrogen man. I told you this on Swole Source, and I’ll tell you here. @Goose12 is a top notch dude, he’s speaking from experience here.

Crashed estrogen is the worst feeling I’ve ever experienced, bar none. You literally feel as if you’re dying and on the last run to hell. Libido is non existent and your junk looks like a zombie. Honestly, I’d never usually suggest this - but if you drink a Hoppy beer or two and your issues improve, it’s likely an estrogen issue. Unfortunately, you might have it at the receptor level currently, so your bloods might not reflect the low E2.
lol no that really helps and hope I am freaking out over nothing, but mind is telling me this is forever and forever which is causing panic. Dark circles coming over my eyes and spots breaking out I feel like I'm literally dying like a zombie corpse, like all life force has sucked out of me

Feeling a bit better this evening after indulging in a couple of cookies though lol

Might do the alcohol test some time this week to see if things improve, as could do with a proper drink
 
Feb 9, 2020
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#22
Have to say this is worse than any psyche drug reaction. It's 2am and can't sleep, feeling racing suicidal thoughts and completely lost to these symptoms except blind faith that it's estrogen downregulation.

I wish I knew of the risk of this suppression I wouldnt have touched any of this andro shit, all I heard was that it's a mild prohormone that doesnt cause suppression on swolesource. It's frankly irresponsible to be pushing something that has the potential to cause serious long term sides

The op has been waiting for a snapback for 6 fucking months. I can barely stand a day feeling like this.

This isn't fluctuating at all, I feel exactly the same every fucking hour and minute like a switch has been turned off in my brain disconnecting me from the rest of my bodily functions.
 

Walker

Well-Known Member
Oct 7, 2017
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#23
Have to say this is worse than any psyche drug reaction. It's 2am and can't sleep, feeling racing suicidal thoughts and completely lost to these symptoms except blind faith that it's estrogen downregulation.

I wish I knew of the risk of this suppression I wouldnt have touched any of this andro shit, all I heard was that it's a mild prohormone that doesnt cause suppression on swolesource. It's frankly irresponsible to be pushing something that has the potential to cause serious long term sides

The op has been waiting for a snapback for 6 fucking months. I can barely stand a day feeling like this.

This isn't fluctuating at all, I feel exactly the same every fucking hour and minute like a switch has been turned off in my brain disconnecting me from the rest of my bodily functions.
My man, your situation and Admiral’s are two different things. His hormones are in bad shape and I don’t believe his is only due to estrogen, he’s been at this battle for many years. I wouldn’t liken your situation to his, as his profile is totally different than yours.

You have crashed estrogen which is causing your mind to race and have these horrible thoughts. Instead of listening to people’s advices on this forum, you are coming on here and having the audacity to tell people they are irresponsible for recommending something to help you for free on their own time? You are responsible for what you put in your body, end of story. I researched EVERYTHING I did religiously before doing it. And if I had a bad response, I researched it. This is how I found out what crashed estrogen does to the body. Sexual functioning is far more dependent on estrogen than testosterone, despite what the general public and sports media/marketing might have you believe. When you crash it, sex is a foreign thing to you. You also become totally irrational and have these suicidal thoughts and issues sleeping because the mind doesn’t shut off. I believe this is due to estrogen’s role in thyroid, but I don’t know for sure.

Bottom line man, it’s going to take some time to regulate. You’ve been off it a week. Some people take three weeks for estrogen to come back after R Andro. You’re not the first person to be in this situation that I’ve personally helped, and they end up above previous baseline 10/10 within a month of cessation.
 
Likes: Goose12
Feb 9, 2020
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#24
My man, your situation and Admiral’s are two different things. His hormones are in bad shape and I don’t believe his is only due to estrogen, he’s been at this battle for many years. I wouldn’t liken your situation to his, as his profile is totally different than yours.

You have crashed estrogen which is causing your mind to race and have these horrible thoughts. Instead of listening to people’s advices on this forum, you are coming on here and having the audacity to tell people they are irresponsible for recommending something to help you for free on their own time? You are responsible for what you put in your body, end of story. I researched EVERYTHING I did religiously before doing it. And if I had a bad response, I researched it. This is how I found out what crashed estrogen does to the body. Sexual functioning is far more dependent on estrogen than testosterone, despite what the general public and sports media/marketing might have you believe. When you crash it, sex is a foreign thing to you. You also become totally irrational and have these suicidal thoughts and issues sleeping because the mind doesn’t shut off. I believe this is due to estrogen’s role in thyroid, but I don’t know for sure.

Bottom line man, it’s going to take some time to regulate. You’ve been off it a week. Some people take three weeks for estrogen to come back after R Andro. You’re not the first person to be in this situation that I’ve personally helped, and they end up above previous baseline 10/10 within a month of cessation.
Apologies for directing my anger at this place, it's unfair to bin blame on anyone but myself

It's just hard to feel calm right now, but doing better mentally, feelng a bit less spacy yesterday and the panicand suicide thoughts have settled down as I have determined I will find a way to come out of this state. Last nigt slept for 6 hours straight through the night without waking which is very good for me

Believe me I am taking as much info on board as possible and appreciate the help,. I have been rotating the herbs for a week now but only have managed 1 workout during that time., after I draw my bloods(test kit finally arrived, results should be come back tomo) I will resume working out hard, sauna, sprinting to help push me towards bringing things back online.

This just fees a bit permanent, like I need a strong antidote to reverse it, testes and dick feel dead though once every other night I got nocturnal erection in my sleep, so that makes me think the HPTA isn't completely shutdown. My fear is that I will eventually have to go on HRT for life

Interestingly when I drank some soy before bed the other night, is when I got the erection in my sleep so it could well be estrogen.
 
Feb 9, 2020
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#25
Today got a spontaneous erection when I noticed this woman checking me out, I don't understand how that's possible when libido is dead and can't get it up manually.

It makes no sense, maybe the herbs are starting to kick in, I don't know

Mentally feeling alright, absolutely no brain fog at all, yet my body feels dead.
 
Feb 12, 2020
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#26
Do you guys think that maybe something has been changed or added to R-Andro?

It seems like there has been multiple bad reactions to R-Andro all talking place around the same time. Lots of us have used R-Andro with no serious negative side effects other than temp low estrogen side effects. It sounds like these guys are reporting something more serious than E getting too low in those of us that are sensitive to lowering E.
 

Goose12

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Oct 6, 2017
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#27
Do you guys think that maybe something has been changed or added to R-Andro?

It seems like there has been multiple bad reactions to R-Andro all talking place around the same time. Lots of us have used R-Andro with no serious negative side effects other than temp low estrogen side effects. It sounds like these guys are reporting something more serious than E getting too low in those of us that are sensitive to lowering E.
If I remember right there has only been one or two productions of Randro. They have not made any new batches for a couple of years. I have taken the stuff since 2017 and it feels the same to me. As you progress and your e becomes more or less sensitive your reaction to it can change.
 
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#28
If I remember right there has only been one or two productions of Randro. They have not made any new batches for a couple of years. I have taken the stuff since 2017 and it feels the same to me. As you progress and your e becomes more or less sensitive your reaction to it can change.
Interesting

When was the last time you have taken R-Andro?

It’s been about a year and half-2 years since the last time I have taken it. So for the one year that I took it on and off I took it several times and never ones reacted badly to it other than mild issues to my E going too low and increased blood pressure that can’t be good for the heart.

I’m suspicious because I know that I’m someone who gets much worse when my E gets too low. I know this from taking Armidex. So for me even though I know Armidex makes me much worse R-Andro still does not. So I’m using that logic when thinking that R-Andro does not crash estrogen to a degree that would leave these guys this messed up for this long so I’m wondering if there is another explanation. Armidex had been known to cause severe long term issues in guys with PFS. It’s been assumed this Is because we are clearly sensitive to inhibiting enzymes and armidex inhibits estrogen conversion enzyme. While the known mechanism of R-Andro is that we get more DHT from conversion from Androsterone. The extra DHT can “oppose” estrogen but it does not “inhibit” enzyme resulting in a long term enzyme disorder. So I’m wondering if an AI was added to R-Andro or of another change was made to it without us knowing about it.

your prob right as you progress your sensitivity to adjusting estrogen changes and that’s the explanation. But I’m still a little suspicious though if anything was changed about R-Andro with out us knowing about it. When was the last time you took it ?
 
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Walker

Well-Known Member
Oct 7, 2017
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#29
Interesting

When was the last time you have taken R-Andro?

It’s been about a year and half-2 years since the last time I have taken it. So for the one year that I took it on and off I took it several times and never ones reacted badly to it other than mild issues to my E going too low and increased blood pressure that can’t be good for the heart.

I’m suspicious because I know that I’m someone who gets much worse when my E gets too low. I know this from taking Armidex. So for me even though I know Armidex makes me much worse R-Andro still does not. So I’m using that logic when thinking that R-Andro does not crash estrogen to a degree that would leave these guys this messed up so I’m wondering if there is another explanation. But than again it’s been a while since I have taken R-Andro. So maybe your right as you progress your sensitivity to adjusting estrogen changes.

I’m still a little suspicious though if anything was changed about R-Andro with out us knowing about it. When was the last time you took it ?
Nothing has changed within the compound, it’s entirely due to your body chemistry at the time you take it. I have the same exact bottles I ordered back in 2016 when I ordered about 20-25 bottles in event it took that many for me to recover. It makes me feel like shit now about a week into it, and has ever since I have put PFS in the rear view. I assume it has to do with the sensitivity of my estrogen at the time through PFS, as well as how DHT starved I was at the time.
 
Likes: Boris
Feb 12, 2020
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#30
Nothing has changed within the compound, it’s entirely due to your body chemistry at the time you take it. I have the same exact bottles I ordered back in 2016 when I ordered about 20-25 bottles in event it took that many for me to recover. It makes me feel like shit now about a week into it, and has ever since I have put PFS in the rear view. I assume it has to do with the sensitivity of my estrogen at the time through PFS, as well as how DHT starved I was at the time.
I see

Well if you still have the same bottles from when we were all getting it when it was first advertised on swole source my theory is defeated.

Stocking up was smart

Or at the very minimum your point proves that your pre vs post PFS reaction to R-Andro is explained by the difference in your body chemistry and not a difference in the product like I was suggesting.

However, would taking R-Andro from a newly ordered bottle cause more severe issues for you then taking R-Andro from your older stock pile ?

I’m likely overthinking this and you and goose are right
 
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Boris

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Staff member
Oct 3, 2017
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#31
Nothing has changed within the compound, it’s entirely due to your body chemistry at the time you take it. I have the same exact bottles I ordered back in 2016 when I ordered about 20-25 bottles in event it took that many for me to recover. It makes me feel like shit now about a week into it, and has ever since I have put PFS in the rear view. I assume it has to do with the sensitivity of my estrogen at the time through PFS, as well as how DHT starved I was at the time.
x2....I also had the same bottle and after trying it over different periods of time, my body would respond differently. It's all body chemistry related
 
Feb 9, 2020
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#32
Interesting

When was the last time you have taken R-Andro?

It’s been about a year and half-2 years since the last time I have taken it. So for the one year that I took it on and off I took it several times and never ones reacted badly to it other than mild issues to my E going too low and increased blood pressure that can’t be good for the heart.

I’m suspicious because I know that I’m someone who gets much worse when my E gets too low. I know this from taking Armidex. So for me even though I know Armidex makes me much worse R-Andro still does not. So I’m using that logic when thinking that R-Andro does not crash estrogen to a degree that would leave these guys this messed up for this long so I’m wondering if there is another explanation. Armidex had been known to cause severe long term issues in guys with PFS. It’s been assumed this Is because we are clearly sensitive to inhibiting enzymes and armidex inhibits estrogen conversion enzyme. While the known mechanism of R-Andro is that we get more DHT from conversion from Androsterone. The extra DHT can “oppose” estrogen but it does not “inhibit” enzyme resulting in a long term enzyme disorder. So I’m wondering if an AI was added to R-Andro or of another change was made to it without us knowing about it.

your prob right as you progress your sensitivity to adjusting estrogen changes and that’s the explanation. But I’m still a little suspicious though if anything was changed about R-Andro with out us knowing about it. When was the last time you took it ?
FWIW I didnt tae R-Andro tabs I took the musclegelz version, which only myself and sleder1 reacted bad to, so its not a significant rise of bad cases, it's just something that can happen with any thing. There are people who react and crash to natural herbs like pine pollen

Saying that I think you should ask yourself if you really need to take it and roll the dice considering it's synthetic substance and we really don't know how it works other than through theory and anecdotal cases.

Especially when there are a host of other ways to raise and balance your hormones naturally.
 
Feb 12, 2020
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#33
x2....I also had the same bottle and after trying it over different periods of time, my body would respond differently. It's all body chemistry related
Interesting

You guys have me curious as to how I would respond to It now. The better judgment side of me is telling me to not go back to it though
 
Feb 12, 2020
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#34
FWIW I didnt tae R-Andro tabs I took the musclegelz version, which only myself and sleder1 reacted bad to, so its not a significant rise of bad cases, it's just something that can happen with any thing. There are people who react and crash to natural herbs like pine pollen

Saying that I think you should ask yourself if you really need to take it and roll the dice considering it's synthetic substance and we really don't know how it works other than through theory and anecdotal cases.

Especially when there are a host of other ways to raise and balance your hormones naturally.
So you and slader took another product containing Androsterone but you Guys did not take super R Andro tabs from Ironmag?

I never viewed taking super R Andro as rolling the dice until now.
 
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Trump_1776

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#35
So you and slader took another product containing Androsterone but you Guys did not take super R Andro tabs from Ironmag?

I never viewed taking super R Andro as rolling the dice until now.
Its all hormones
 
Likes: 5-Alpha
Feb 9, 2020
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#36
So you and slader took another product containing Androsterone but you Guys did not take super R Andro tabs from Ironmag?

I never viewed taking super R Andro as rolling the dice until now.
The one we took has both epi-andro and dhea in it and is trans dermal delivery system, meant to be very close to the design of the super r andro that has been discontinued.

Generally playing with your hormones with synthetics is rolling the dice, unless you know for certain you are going to get a benign response from previous experience. Even then it's still a shot in the dark.

I'm guessing if you're already lean it's easier to plummet estrogen or fuck up DHT where I notice now a lot of pfs guys running it have a bit of fat storage. Theres so many different variables it can turn into a quagmire of endless theory,
 
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#37
The one we took has both epi-andro and dhea in it and is trans dermal delivery system, meant to be very close to the design of the super r andro that has been discontinued.

Generally playing with your hormones with synthetics is rolling the dice, unless you know for certain you are going to get a benign response from previous experience. Even then it's still a shot in the dark.

I'm guessing if you're already lean it's easier to plummet estrogen or fuck up DHT where I notice now a lot of pfs guys running it have a bit of fat storage. Theres so many different variables it can turn into a quagmire of endless theory,
https://www.musclegelz.com/products/andro-hard/

Ohh ok you are talking about musclegelz replica of the old primordial performance’s Andro Hard. (The company that got targeted by the feds because their LEGAL products were too good ?) More specifically a replica of primordial performances version of Andro hard containing both epiandro and Androsterone.

And this is what both you and slader took ? And admiral which product did he take ?
 
Feb 9, 2020
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#38
ANDRO HARD – Muscle Gelz

Ohh ok you are talking about musclegelz replica of the old primordial performance’s Andro Hard. (The company that got targeted by the feds because their LEGAL products were too good ?) More specifically a replica of primordial performances version of Andro hard containing both epiandro and Androsterone.

And this is what both you and slader took ? And admiral which product did he take ?
Yes that's the one we both took but many others have reacted positively or didn't at all.

I think admiral took r-andro pills and played with 4-andro at the same time, double russian roulette

I also think there's a chance it can imbalance DHEA levels, or puts DHT out of balance

Why do you think they got targeted by the feds? Obviously it wasn't because they thought that they were financial threat market or because they had an agenda to keep men weak away from the good stuff?
 
Feb 12, 2020
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#39
Yes that's the one we both took but many others have reacted positively or didn't at all.

I think admiral took r-andro pills and played with 4-andro at the same time, double russian roulette

I also think there's a chance it can imbalance DHEA levels, or puts DHT out of balance

Why do you think they got targeted by the feds? Obviously it wasn't because they thought that they were financial threat market or because they had an agenda to keep men weak away from the good stuff?
They got raided, their products got seized forcing them to go out of business. A substantial amount of time later the chargers against them got dropped because none of their products were actually illegal or contained illegal substances. There is a list of legal vs banned pro hormones. No listed ingredient on any of their products were banned. Law enforcement obtained a warrant to search and seize the company’s product with no probable cause. Simply suspicion over the quality, popularity and effectiveness of a small company making good products. Because the company’s products happened to be supplements and because they were literally that good allowing it set a “bad precedent”. The last thing they want in this country are small businesses making quality affordable treatments in the form of supplements to treat chronic conditions. That’s a threat to big pharmaceutical companies that control us.

Androsterone and epiandro are what they are so seeing that the individuals body chemistry at the time of taking it is to blame my point is moot. But I still think it may be worth noting that the two of the three cases we are aware of where people get a lot worse from either Androsterone or epiandro involves muscelgels Andro hard.

Admiral has severely low androgens I think I read in an older thread of his. This may have contributed to his feeling shut down after r Andro. I still feel good about taking r Andro tabs
 
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Feb 9, 2020
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#40
They got raided, their products got seized forcing them to go out of business. A substantial amount of time later the chargers against them got dropped because none of their products were actually illegal or contained illegal substances. There is a list of legal vs banned pro hormones. No listed ingredient on any of their products were banned. Law enforcement obtained a warrant to search and seize the company’s product with no probable cause. Simply suspicion over the quality, popularity and effectiveness of a small company making good products. Because the company’s products happened to be supplements and because they were literally that good allowing it set a “bad precedent”. The last thing they want in this country are small businesses making quality affordable treatments in the form of supplements to treat chronic conditions. That’s a threat to big pharmaceutical companies that control us.

Androsterone and epiandro are what they are so seeing that the individuals body chemistry at the time of taking it is to blame my point is moot. But I still think it may be worth noting that the two of the three cases we are aware of where people get a lot worse from either Androsterone or epiandro involves muscelgels Andro hard.

Admiral has severely low androgens I think I read in an older thread of his. This may have contributed to his feeling shut down after r Andro. I still feel good about taking r Andro tabs
hmm I'm not inclined into believing conspiracies but that does sound plausible

Strangely enough I feel mentally better now after taking r-andro, it completely wiped away brain fog but it has obliterated strength, energy and libido.

I've read that a DHT derivative can cause a negative feedback loop in the HPTA to which then cause natural testosterone levels to fall, which I think has happened in my case considering I got a call from the doctors office today confirming I'm now borderline low in T and some other areas but got to wait to see in person tomorrow before I recieve all details