PSSD Following Ashwagandha/Shilajit usage

Ergogenic Health

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2019
139
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Melbourne
#1
Good evening everyone,

I am currently battling what seems to be PSSD symptoms from Ashwagandha KSM-66 usage
My symptoms are:
-Genital Numbness
-Reduced Sensation
-No sexual arousal
-Normal erections
-Morning wood I have every single day.
-No smell
-No good feeling after orgasm. Blunted.

It's literally lasted longer than 2 years now.

About me:
-Low Cortisol
-Low Aldosterone
-High Testosterone, DHT, And E (manageable with calcium d glucarate and nettle root).
-Excellent overall health.

What seems to "cure" me is a drug called Cyproheptadine (Periactin), which is a known serotonin antagonist. But the weird component is this. When I take 1mg of this drug, I will be sleepy (normal response) and wake up feeling tired. The following day I feel the same. BUT it's day 3 and 4 AFTER that first dose, I feel "Cured". I will literally wake up feeling fucking NORMAL again. Its like that vibrational rush is back. My symptoms of Genital numbness, No orgasm, No sexual arousal, no feeling, muscle weakness, all disappear on day 3-4. This stays like this for a week. But slowly slowly, I return back to my numb state.

So the question arises... HOW/WHY? I suspect looking into the 5-HT1a receptor, 5-HT2a receptor and the 5-HT2c receptors.

Is it just a Cortisol rebound following Cypro? Rebound elevation of cortisol following cyproheptadine withdrawal in Cushing's disease from a pituitary macroadenoma. - PubMed - NCBI

Ashwagandha Lowers cortisol and can cause anhedonia/laziness for some people.

So what else makes my symptoms worse:
-High dose Zinc Supplements
-Apigenin rich foods
-Ginger
-Potatoes (nightshades)

If anyone can explain the mechanism as to how Cyproheptadine cures me, that would be greatly appreciated.

I also must add that I got windows of cure with Liquid Zeolite drops, and St Johns Wort Tea.....5-HT1A?!?!?!?
 
Likes: croboy17

barbaar

Well-Known Member
Oct 16, 2017
876
652
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The Netherlands
#2
One of the theories here is that GR (glucocorticoid receptor) is upregulated, causing a ton of problems. There's more to it than that but my brain is too fried atm to fully understand it.

If you lower cortisol, it would upregulate GR to compensate for lower levels of cortisol.

Maybe the cortisol rebound temporarily downregulates GR to normal levels again, which could explain the delay before you start feeling better I think.
 

Ergogenic Health

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2019
139
56
28
23
Melbourne
#4
One of the theories here is that GR (glucocorticoid receptor) is upregulated, causing a ton of problems. There's more to it than that but my brain is too fried atm to fully understand it.

If you lower cortisol, it would upregulate GR to compensate for lower levels of cortisol.

Maybe the cortisol rebound temporarily downregulates GR to normal levels again, which could explain the delay before you start feeling better I think.
Thank you for sharing this.
I will look into it. How do I downregulate the glucocorticoid receptors!? How does Licorice work...?
 

Ergogenic Health

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2019
139
56
28
23
Melbourne
#8
Shilajit, a traditional Indian medicine, reduced immobility and increased climbing behavior whilst increasing adrenal weight and corticosterone levels in the forced swim test in rats [72] and Myelophil, based on compounds used for fatigue in Chinese medicine, increased glucocorticoid receptor expression in the hypothalamus and hippocampus , and altered expression of cytokines such as interleukin (IL-10) and tumour necrosis factor-alpha (TNF-í µí»¼) using the chronic cold stress and restraint model in mice [100]. One of the most interesting proposals is the switch to a new steady state from chronic hypocortisolaemia to a healthy, reactive state using the model-based predictive control (MPC) solution originally proposed by Gupta and colleagues [35]. ...
 

5 alpha

Well-Known Member
Oct 3, 2017
454
203
43
#13
One of the theories here is that GR (glucocorticoid receptor) is upregulated, causing a ton of problems. There's more to it than that but my brain is too fried atm to fully understand it.

If you lower cortisol, it would upregulate GR to compensate for lower levels of cortisol.

Maybe the cortisol rebound temporarily downregulates GR to normal levels again, which could explain the delay before you start feeling better I think.
Barbaar,

So the cortisol rebound down regulating the unregulated GR receptors. This actually makes sense

I have mentioned on several different threads that I was almost cured of PFS from a three day 50 mg RU cycle back in 2017. My temp recovery was in the form of a bounce back in the weeks following the RU cycle. If what you are suggesting here is correct this is what could of happened in my case:

RU blocked my cortisol receptors causing my already up regulated cortisol receptors to up regulate even more in order to compensate for the fact that they were now blocked. I was only on the RU for three days so did not have the chance to feel worse.

Because the RU was blocking my cortisol receptors I started producing more cortisol to try to compensate for the Cortisol receptors being blocked. (We seen this in jinstewart’e on cycle RU labs)

After I came off the RU and after the RU left my system and my cortisol receptors were no longer blocked. With this being said because I still had high amounts of cortisol in my blood i experienced the rebound effect you mentioned by causing the Down regulation of the up regulated receptors which resulted in my temp 80 percent recovery.

Assuming this theory is correct why did I relapse? Did my cortisol receptors up regulate again in response to stress ? And if so why would they have ?

If this is all correct I should be cycling cortisol.
 

barbaar

Well-Known Member
Oct 16, 2017
876
652
93
The Netherlands
#14
Barbaar,

So the cortisol rebound down regulating the unregulated GR receptors. This actually makes sense

I have mentioned on several different threads that I was almost cured of PFS from a three day 50 mg RU cycle back in 2017. My temp recovery was in the form of a bounce back in the weeks following the RU cycle. If what you are suggesting here is correct this is what could of happened in my case:

RU blocked my cortisol receptors causing my already up regulated cortisol receptors to up regulate even more in order to compensate for the fact that they were now blocked. I was only on the RU for three days so did not have the chance to feel worse.

Because the RU was blocking my cortisol receptors I started producing more cortisol to try to compensate for the Cortisol receptors being blocked. (We seen this in jinstewart’e on cycle RU labs)

After I came off the RU and after the RU left my system and my cortisol receptors were no longer blocked. With this being said because I still had high amounts of cortisol in my blood i experienced the rebound effect you mentioned by causing the Down regulation of the up regulated receptors which resulted in my temp 80 percent recovery.

Assuming this theory is correct why did I relapse? Did my cortisol receptors up regulate again in response to stress ? And if so why would they have ?

If this is all correct I should be cycling cortisol.
Honestly I couldn't tell you why you would relapse or not. Maybe something else in the HPA axis is screwed too and causes the receptors to get messed up again.

But then on the other hand people have gotten cured or at least significantly better after cycling cortisol, and stay that way.

Maybe you need high cortisol for longer than just the rebound to unfuck whatever else in the system is keeping it out of whack.
 
Likes: Aflac94

5 alpha

Well-Known Member
Oct 3, 2017
454
203
43
#15
Honestly I couldn't tell you why you would relapse or not. Maybe something else in the HPA axis is screwed too and causes the receptors to get messed up again.

But then on the other hand people have gotten cured or at least significantly better after cycling cortisol, and stay that way.

Maybe you need high cortisol for longer than just the rebound to unfuck whatever else in the system is keeping it out of whack.
Hmmm...

Maybe it’s the CB1 receptor that Helen has mentioned recently in the other thread resulting in the GR receptors being all out of whack

It’s complicated as hell but I have been trying to read this. It’s about the CB1 receptor and a lot of other related complicated shit haha

Neurobiological Interactions Between Stress and the Endocannabinoid System

“Additionally, in almost every brain region examined, exposure to chronic stress reliably causes a downregulation or loss of cannabinoid type 1 (CB1) receptors”

CB1 receptors down regulated causing GR receptors to stay up regulated ?
 
Last edited:

Aflac94

Well-Known Member
Oct 10, 2017
441
247
43
United States
#16
Honestly I couldn't tell you why you would relapse or not. Maybe something else in the HPA axis is screwed too and causes the receptors to get messed up again.

But then on the other hand people have gotten cured or at least significantly better after cycling cortisol, and stay that way.

Maybe you need high cortisol for longer than just the rebound to unfuck whatever else in the system is keeping it out of whack.
Bump. Are you gonna try this? @5 alpha
 

5 alpha

Well-Known Member
Oct 3, 2017
454
203
43
#17
Bump. Are you gonna try this? @5 alpha
Yes I’m going to start playing with cortisol and see what happens. First I’m going to try the Licorice Extract for a month. Based on this study and what everyone is saying it increase cortisol:

Licorice abuse: time to send a warning message

I’m going to do a three day on three day off rotation for thirty days so I can get a solid idea as to what happens when I increase cortisol followed by letting it drop again over and over again.

I started yesterday. I can say that I responded pretty strongly to it after one dose. Not necessarily in a positive way but in a way that went beyond a placebo effect. More energy, more alert. Felt good in a way. Better and more focused work out. Muscles got more solid than usual and my veins were bigger making it appear my blood was flowing better. R-Andro would not even do this after one dose. So like others are reporting there is something to this...

I’m not sure if it’s good or bad for PFS though. Like if it’s what we want to be doing increasing cortisol. I think there is a chance increasing it could make the underlining problem worse or maybe at least depending on which case we are. I slept horribly was like wired all night haha .

Way too early to draw and conclusions but clearly us PFS people react strongly to this Licorice stuff.
 

5 alpha

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Oct 3, 2017
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Trump_1776

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May 5, 2018
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#18
I tried licorice by the way, I do not like the feeling.
 

5 alpha

Well-Known Member
Oct 3, 2017
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#19
I tried licorice by the way, I do not like the feeling.
I can understand why. It’s a pretty unnatural and unnecessary overly stimulated feeling. I did not get labs for this experiment but I cannot imagine that my cortisol has shot through the roof on two days of a natural herb. I’m assuming it’s only a slight increase despite the somewhat strong effect.

It’s pretty obvious that there is something wrong with this type of a response a little bit of extra cortisol.
 

Ergogenic Health

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2019
139
56
28
23
Melbourne
#20
Yes I’m going to start playing with cortisol and see what happens. First I’m going to try the Licorice Extract for a month. Based on this study and what everyone is saying it increase cortisol:

Licorice abuse: time to send a warning message

I’m going to do a three day on three day off rotation for thirty days so I can get a solid idea as to what happens when I increase cortisol followed by letting it drop again over and over again.

I started yesterday. I can say that I responded pretty strongly to it after one dose. Not necessarily in a positive way but in a way that went beyond a placebo effect. More energy, more alert. Felt good in a way. Better and more focused work out. Muscles got more solid than usual and my veins were bigger making it appear my blood was flowing better. R-Andro would not even do this after one dose. So like others are reporting there is something to this...

I’m not sure if it’s good or bad for PFS though. Like if it’s what we want to be doing increasing cortisol. I think there is a chance increasing it could make the underlining problem worse or maybe at least depending on which case we are. I slept horribly was like wired all night haha .

Way too early to draw and conclusions but clearly us PFS people react strongly to this Licorice stuff.

After my horrendous Hydrogen water experience, I had some licorice again this morning after a 2 weeks break.

It is REALLY energising, and definitely good for alertness. But also anxiety-inducing.

It massively improves my muscular strength/pumps though.